The "Smiths" Dilemma.

THE "SMITHS" DILEMMA.

Smith and Smith: can they co-exist?

Much was said about how can two low-efficient scorers co-exist when OKC brought both JR Smith and Josh Smith at the beginning of December.
Since then, they have appeared in 9 games in a Thunder uniform. OKC has won 7 of them, and the 2 losses came while they had no Kemba Walker and D-12 (though Howard appeared in one game).
But, we're here to take a deeper look at both Smiths numbers and impact for their team, and finally try to awnser: is it possible to have 2 inefficient players and still win?

First let's look at the numbers:
-> JR Smith: 9.7pts (40% FG%, 53% 3pt, 69% FT), 3.2 rebs, 1.3 ast, 1.0 stl, .2 blk, 1.3 TO in 25mpg.
-> Josh Smith: 9.6pts (39,5 FG%, 20% 3pt, 66% FT), 6.2 rebs, 2.3 ast, 1.1 stl, 2.1 blk, 1 TO in 26mpg.
-> OKC before trade: 100+ points scored: 11 games
100+ points allowed: 10 games
record: 9-8
-> OKC after trade: 100+ points scored: 6 games
100+ points allowed: 4 games
record: 7-2

Smith and Smith combines to take a little bit more than 17FGs while knocking down almost 7 of them.
Thunder's numbers are much better defensively, only allowing 4 games over 100pts for their opponents, less than 50% of the games they played that spawn (and two of them came when they had no Dwight - Kemba, a great defensive duo). But their offensive efficiency has dropped a little bit with Smiths taking so many shots and knocking down few of them.
The conclusion is: you can live with JRs 3pt shooting (ultra-efficient 53% since joining Oklahoma) or Josh's playmaking / defense, but you can't have both taking 17 shots when you have no playmaker to set them for easy baskets. OKC has been piling up wins with them, but that's thanks to the trio of Kemba / PG / Howard who has been scoring at crazy efficiency and their depth.

So there are two solutions for that case: 1 - Bring a floor general to play with them off the bench
2 - Trade one of them

What about if I tell you Oklahoma's front office has been actively looking to do both?
Rumors report that they have been trying to acquire a floor general, but it has not been easy, specially with Rajon Rondo's (and, why not, Kendall Marshall's) recent trade and the announcement that Deron Williams is on the verge of moving. That reduces the number of candidates to almost zero, though OKC is confident they will get their playmaker sooner rather than later:

Marcos Beck wrote:There have been talks, but not more than that. We're happy with what we have.

It has been very difficult, though. But sources confirmed they have advanced situations and may even have a done deal or two as their aces in the holes. The most difficult thing is that they're not willing to get worse defensively, though they can give up depth (and, why not, value) to bring who they want.
Also it's worth noting that OKC has some financial problems. They have yet to extend Kemba Walker but that would (probably) push them to Hard CAP territory next season.

Marcos Beck wrote:We're aware of our financial problems. But, trust me, situation is completely under control. In the end we might have to do some cost-cutting moves, but we want to pay as much as needed for a chance at winning the ring.

Maybe more moves by the Thunder franchise when Trade Restrictions to both Smiths (do not forget about Walker) are up? Marcos has never hided his desire to bring another franchise-level player to play next to PG24 and D12 and would do something really crazy to bring that player.
Remains to be seen. Stay tuned at OKC's daily updates! See ya all!

Just a note here. I'm trying to find the Jamal inside of me, and I'm trying to find a system for my team. Everyone knows that.
I hope I can find what I'm looking for and that I can have a system as successful as Rubio's Knicks or Harden's Rockets. If I can get to OP level of system it would be amazing. Just amazing. But that's not happening LOL

Looking at your schedule the last 9 games - don't you think that you won the games you expected to win rather than the Smiths doing something revolutionary? I mean, there are some good wins there but I think if we still had a betting line I would bet on you in all of these games except one. I'm curious to see what effect these dudes had on your star players. Is PG taking as many shots pre and post trade? What about his usage and efficiency - did that improve?

I said this in the trade chatter thread when you first made the trade, but I still think you'll eventually realize you have to trade Josh Smith. It's hard to even find a system that he'll play well in, and if you do, it's basically built all around him, and not many teams want to build around Josh Smith. He works well in a high post offense, I remember from my days in Jamal's old league where he and Horford led me to the ECF and that's as good as I've ever seen him play. Everyone who has ever had this guy eventually trades him. It just won't work.

But Andrei is right - you've had a cake schedule the last few games. The toughest teams you've won against recently are the Rockets without Harden and the Lakers without Horford. You lost to GSW and POR. But I guess props for taking care of the teams below you, something my team can't do. Anyway, I'll be chasing you for that #3 spot, you play Utah twice in a row coming up.

Unless you can constantly tell Josh Smith to post up or drive instead of taking Jumpers...he's not going to be very good. I also think it's weird everyone seems to play him at PF. Is that the only position people have played him at ?

He should be the full-time SF in my opinion..probably SF/SG. Seems like he'd have much more production and effectiveness playing anywhere except PF.

Higrade (GSW) wrote:Unless you can constantly tell Josh Smith to post up or drive instead of taking Jumpers...he's not going to be very good. I also think it's weird everyone seems to play him at PF. Is that the only position people have played him at ?

He should be the full-time SF in my opinion..probably SF/SG. Seems like he'd have much more production and effectiveness playing anywhere except PF.

Failed hard in SAC town.

I'm starting to realize how to build a real TEAM here. It's not always about value, it's having players who really fits your system, are effective with your system, like the Knicks.
We may be doing few changes here giving up an astronomic amount of value for guys we want. Then we're going to try to run a system like the Knicks or the Rockets do, take the best out of every player, maximize their production.

It's a risk but I took the risk in trading LeBron so there's nothing that can be considered a real risky move after that LOL
I've capitalized enough on talent for my team. It's time now to give up on talent and build a team. Hope it pans out!

andrei (POR) wrote:Looking at your schedule the last 9 games - don't you think that you won the games you expected to win rather than the Smiths doing something revolutionary? I mean, there are some good wins there but I think if we still had a betting line I would bet on you in all of these games except one. I'm curious to see what effect these dudes had on your star players. Is PG taking as many shots pre and post trade? What about his usage and efficiency - did that improve?

You have a point here, that's why I'm not giving JR neither Josh credits for our success late. We've beaten team that we're expected to beat (the exceptions may be HOU at the beginning of the month and CHI at the end, though both were home wins) and lost to POR and GSW.
But remember also I was without D12 and Kemba against GSW, and Kemba (because D12 played through injury) against your POR team. Still you guys got the win and there's no excuse, injures can happen with every team.

The real success of this team has been that George / Howard / Kemba trio. They have been extremely effective and efficient scoring the ball. Look at how PG and D12 won us that Lakers game. And remember that while they had no Horford, we had no Kemba too. So injuries cannot justify Ws or Ls.

When I first started playing PB3 I tried to accumulate as much talent as possible. As great as that sounds, it very rarely ends up with a great team. Pieces don't mesh well and they don't play as a cohesive unit. You need to find out which players are absolute keepers and buil around them.

Rizzo (NO) wrote:When I first started playing PB3 I tried to accumulate as much talent as possible. As great as that sounds, it very rarely ends up with a great team. Pieces don't mesh well and they don't play as a cohesive unit. You need to find out which players are absolute keepers and buil around them.

I'm trying to do exactly that.
It all starts with George / Howard / Kemba. Those guys are fits no matter what.
Then you have lower tier players. I think that the role players who mesh well with my team are Brewer / Bullock. One can defend at such high level and is extremely low usage guy. The other can space the floor just like JR Smith but at 7M less. Barea is not the ideal 2nd tier PG for my team but there's little need to rush on him since he seems to fit well too.
Then we have Al Jef who's a case to be further analyzed. He has lots of value, but his 77 scoring rate won't help. He also does not draw lots of fouls. His man-to-man defense, while very acceptable, is not something irreplaceable like D12. And, speaking of Howard, they don't seem to fit. I went after Big Al to have a better trade bait.
In the end I think most of the guys can fit into my team. The exceptions are JR Smith, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson and Derrick Williams. I'm studying their case to know better what to do with those 3.
Maybe any of the guys who fits may have to leave too for a trade to happen. I just hope not.

The next year if you have a lot of salaries i think that the comisioner penalize you and important piece kemba walker he win can't extend your contract.
In my opinion are valids kemba brewer george howard and bullock.
The rest of players al jefferson josh smith jr smith aaron gray barea and derrick williams can be replace for other players more cheaps.

You paid for al jefferson josh smith jr smith barea aaron gray and derrick williams 43 millions

Having multiple talented players is not an issue if you only know how to utilize them accordingly.

rh0xxy (LAC) wrote:Having multiple talented players is not an issue if you only know how to utilize them accordingly.

I must agree with you.
Easier said than done, though, but we're finding some success so if anyone grabs a Smith or 2 they may have the same success with right tactics.